Friday, June 12, 2020

Re: Orthodogs ACL and CCL? Collin

 

My pit just had the tplo surgery a few weeks ago.. I had read that a torn cruciate tear is common with this breed. Because he has an autoimmune disease and food allergies, he's been on steroids for a long time so vet said we couldn't do the fishing procedure so we did the tplo. I've not heard of dogs reinjuring same leg but there's a 50% chance of getting a tear on the other leg. The meniscus may also tear. My rottie had to have a tplo, then had a meniscus tear, then a year later, she blew out her other knee. Sorry this didn't answer your question about injury to the same leg but I've never had that experience. Good luck! 

On Fri, Jun 12, 2020, 1:12 PM Elice Sturdivant elicesturdivant@yahoo.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Hello,

Looking for some group input here, thanks in advance. Collin is a 7.5 84lb pit. At 6 months old, he was diagnosed with hip displasia and the vet recommended that we wait on any corrective surgery until he finished growing. THEN he tore the ACL in that knee and we decided it would not be prudent to wait. I can't remember the order that we had the surgeries, but ultimately we had a femoral head ostectomy and then the ACL repair (I think the lateral suture???)

Fast forward to December 2019- He tore the CCL in the same knee. He goes in for TPLO surgery in 2 weeks. I can't remember ever hearing about dog blowing out both tendons in the same leg. Does anyone have any experience with this? I would love to hear your input.

Thanks!
Elice Sturdivant and Collin

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Posted by: Anola Saycocie <anolasaycocie@gmail.com>
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Re: Orthodogs ACL and CCL? Collin

 

I have known a lot of folks with unsuccessful results from TPLO.  I would always go for the less invasive route if it's not a genetic thing.  My girl injured her knee, I was there and I know what happened, so I suspected it was not genetic.  Both her knees were sound the rest of her life.  She was still running agility until 2 weeks before cancer took her at 11 years of age.  

You have to take a lot into account when making your decision.  I would still stick to traditional first as you can always do the other surgery.  If you go TPLO and it doesn't work, you are screwed.

Jane in FL mailto:jtutton_99@yahoo.com


On Friday, June 12, 2020, 05:53:47 PM EDT, Melissa Shelly melissa.shelly@gmail.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 

I think the TPLOs are mote successful than the fishing line repair... My dog had TPLOs on both legs and has done pretty well. He also had elbow surgery at a very young age for fragmented coronoid process. All these surgeries, in my opinion, were a result of pediatric neutering which appears to predispose animals to orthopedic injuries. Was your dog a rescue??? 

Sent from my iPhone

On Jun 12, 2020, at 5:16 PM, 'Eileen L.' dogstareml@gmail.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

  

Yes, my cattle dog did it when she was 6 years old.  First the "fishline", then then TPLO, 6 months later.  The TPLO was successful; she was running again like her old self, and you never knew she'd had two surgeries on that knee.  When she tore the opposite leg 6 months after that, we went right for the TPLO.  

Eileen in Wisconsin

On Fri, Jun 12, 2020 at 3:12 PM Elice Sturdivant elicesturdivant@yahoo.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Hello,

Looking for some group input here, thanks in advance. Collin is a 7.5 84lb pit. At 6 months old, he was diagnosed with hip displasia and the vet recommended that we wait on any corrective surgery until he finished growing. THEN he tore the ACL in that knee and we decided it would not be prudent to wait. I can't remember the order that we had the surgeries, but ultimately we had a femoral head ostectomy and then the ACL repair (I think the lateral suture???)

Fast forward to December 2019- He tore the CCL in the same knee. He goes in for TPLO surgery in 2 weeks. I can't remember ever hearing about dog blowing out both tendons in the same leg. Does anyone have any experience with this? I would love to hear your input.

Thanks!
Elice Sturdivant and Collin

__._,_.___

Posted by: Jane Tutton <jtutton_99@yahoo.com>
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Re: Orthodogs ACL and CCL? Collin

 

You often see many orthopedic issues and repeat issues in dogs who have spayed or neutered at a young age. 
It is critical for the dog to reach full maturity and allow growth plates to close prior to altering. 

Hopefully this information is helpful for future dogs. 

Michal


People who have time on their hands will inevitably waste the time of people who have work to do -- Thomas Sowell


On Friday, June 12, 2020, 5:03:11 PM EDT, Jane Tutton jtutton_99@yahoo.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 

ACL and CCL are the same.  It is called an ACL in humans because it faces the front (anterior) it faces the head (cranium) in dogs.  It is very possible to retear the CCL in a dog.  The tendon and scar tissue support that joint.  If they reinjure it, you get another tear or complete rupture.  My girl, who I just lost in March, had a traditional (fishing line) repair in 2009 and never had another issue with that knee.  It is more common for the dog to blow out the other knee within a year.  One reason to do the traditional repair first is that it is less invasive.  Both TPLO and TTA involve cutting the bone.  The traditional repair keeps the angle of the joint as it originally was.

I hope this helps.

Jane in FL mailto:jtutton_99@yahoo.com


On Friday, June 12, 2020, 04:12:22 PM EDT, Elice Sturdivant elicesturdivant@yahoo.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 

Hello,

Looking for some group input here, thanks in advance. Collin is a 7.5 84lb pit. At 6 months old, he was diagnosed with hip displasia and the vet recommended that we wait on any corrective surgery until he finished growing. THEN he tore the ACL in that knee and we decided it would not be prudent to wait. I can't remember the order that we had the surgeries, but ultimately we had a femoral head ostectomy and then the ACL repair (I think the lateral suture???)

Fast forward to December 2019- He tore the CCL in the same knee. He goes in for TPLO surgery in 2 weeks. I can't remember ever hearing about dog blowing out both tendons in the same leg. Does anyone have any experience with this? I would love to hear your input.

Thanks!
Elice Sturdivant and Collin

__._,_.___

Posted by: Michal Whitney <michal_whitney@yahoo.com>
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.

__,_._,___

Re: Orthodogs ACL and CCL? Collin

 

I think the TPLOs are mote successful than the fishing line repair.. My dog had TPLOs on both legs and has done pretty well. He also had elbow surgery at a very young age for fragmented coronoid process. All these surgeries, in my opinion, were a result of pediatric neutering which appears to predispose animals to orthopedic injuries. Was your dog a rescue??? 

Sent from my iPhone

On Jun 12, 2020, at 5:16 PM, 'Eileen L.' dogstareml@gmail.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

  

Yes, my cattle dog did it when she was 6 years old.  First the "fishline", then then TPLO, 6 months later.  The TPLO was successful; she was running again like her old self, and you never knew she'd had two surgeries on that knee.  When she tore the opposite leg 6 months after that, we went right for the TPLO.  

Eileen in Wisconsin

On Fri, Jun 12, 2020 at 3:12 PM Elice Sturdivant elicesturdivant@yahoo.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Hello,

Looking for some group input here, thanks in advance. Collin is a 7.5 84lb pit. At 6 months old, he was diagnosed with hip displasia and the vet recommended that we wait on any corrective surgery until he finished growing. THEN he tore the ACL in that knee and we decided it would not be prudent to wait. I can't remember the order that we had the surgeries, but ultimately we had a femoral head ostectomy and then the ACL repair (I think the lateral suture???)

Fast forward to December 2019- He tore the CCL in the same knee. He goes in for TPLO surgery in 2 weeks. I can't remember ever hearing about dog blowing out both tendons in the same leg. Does anyone have any experience with this? I would love to hear your input.

Thanks!
Elice Sturdivant and Collin

__._,_.___

Posted by: Melissa Shelly <melissa.shelly@gmail.com>
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.

__,_._,___

Re: Orthodogs ACL and CCL? Collin

 


Yeah, that's what I'm dealing with on my other dog! We had the 1st ACL back in Dec and she will have the 2nd one done after Collin gets this one done. I did the traditional ACL and holy cow! The TPLO was a breeze compared to that!
 
 

On Friday, June 12, 2020, 04:24:12 PM EDT, Marlene Gardner platinumsun213@yahoo.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 

We did - sort of.  My big male Boxer ruptured  the left cruciate and had the old "fishing line repair" which is what I think you're talking about.  He had a long recuperation.  Within 4 months he had torn the CL on the OTHER/RIGHT leg!  That time we had TPLO.  Much easier recuperation and better outcome.
Or vet told us at the time of the first injury....."it's not uncommon for these dogs to blow the other knee " :-(
About 2 yrs after that he was charged "out of nowhere" by an unleashed dog (my dog was leashed) and he tore the meniscus in the FIRST LEG/LEFT TRADITIONAL REPAIR.
Marlene


On Friday, June 12, 2020, 01:12:18 PM PDT, Elice Sturdivant elicesturdivant@yahoo.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 

Hello,

Looking for some group input here, thanks in advance. Collin is a 7.5 84lb pit. At 6 months old, he was diagnosed with hip displasia and the vet recommended that we wait on any corrective surgery until he finished growing. THEN he tore the ACL in that knee and we decided it would not be prudent to wait. I can't remember the order that we had the surgeries, but ultimately we had a femoral head ostectomy and then the ACL repair (I think the lateral suture???)

Fast forward to December 2019- He tore the CCL in the same knee. He goes in for TPLO surgery in 2 weeks. I can't remember ever hearing about dog blowing out both tendons in the same leg. Does anyone have any experience with this? I would love to hear your input.

Thanks!
Elice Sturdivant and Collin

__._,_.___

Posted by: Elice Sturdivant <elicesturdivant@yahoo.com>
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (5)

.

__,_._,___

Re: Orthodogs ACL and CCL? Collin

 

Yes, my cattle dog did it when she was 6 years old.  First the "fishline", then then TPLO, 6 months later.  The TPLO was successful; she was running again like her old self, and you never knew she'd had two surgeries on that knee.  When she tore the opposite leg 6 months after that, we went right for the TPLO.  

Eileen in Wisconsin

On Fri, Jun 12, 2020 at 3:12 PM Elice Sturdivant elicesturdivant@yahoo.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Hello,

Looking for some group input here, thanks in advance. Collin is a 7.5 84lb pit. At 6 months old, he was diagnosed with hip displasia and the vet recommended that we wait on any corrective surgery until he finished growing. THEN he tore the ACL in that knee and we decided it would not be prudent to wait. I can't remember the order that we had the surgeries, but ultimately we had a femoral head ostectomy and then the ACL repair (I think the lateral suture???)

Fast forward to December 2019- He tore the CCL in the same knee. He goes in for TPLO surgery in 2 weeks. I can't remember ever hearing about dog blowing out both tendons in the same leg. Does anyone have any experience with this? I would love to hear your input.

Thanks!
Elice Sturdivant and Collin

__._,_.___

Posted by: "Eileen L." <dogstareml@gmail.com>
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (4)

.

__,_._,___

Re: Orthodogs ACL and CCL? Collin

 

ACL and CCL are the same.  It is called an ACL in humans because it faces the front (anterior) it faces the head (cranium) in dogs.  It is very possible to retear the CCL in a dog.  The tendon and scar tissue support that joint.  If they reinjure it, you get another tear or complete rupture.  My girl, who I just lost in March, had a traditional (fishing line) repair in 2009 and never had another issue with that knee.  It is more common for the dog to blow out the other knee within a year.  One reason to do the traditional repair first is that it is less invasive.  Both TPLO and TTA involve cutting the bone.  The traditional repair keeps the angle of the joint as it originally was.

I hope this helps.

Jane in FL mailto:jtutton_99@yahoo.com


On Friday, June 12, 2020, 04:12:22 PM EDT, Elice Sturdivant elicesturdivant@yahoo.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 

Hello,

Looking for some group input here, thanks in advance. Collin is a 7.5 84lb pit. At 6 months old, he was diagnosed with hip displasia and the vet recommended that we wait on any corrective surgery until he finished growing. THEN he tore the ACL in that knee and we decided it would not be prudent to wait. I can't remember the order that we had the surgeries, but ultimately we had a femoral head ostectomy and then the ACL repair (I think the lateral suture???)

Fast forward to December 2019- He tore the CCL in the same knee. He goes in for TPLO surgery in 2 weeks. I can't remember ever hearing about dog blowing out both tendons in the same leg. Does anyone have any experience with this? I would love to hear your input.

Thanks!
Elice Sturdivant and Collin

__._,_.___

Posted by: Jane Tutton <jtutton_99@yahoo.com>
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (3)

.

__,_._,___

Re: Orthodogs ACL and CCL? Collin

 

We did - sort of.  My big male Boxer ruptured  the left cruciate and had the old "fishing line repair" which is what I think you're talking about.  He had a long recuperation.  Within 4 months he had torn the CL on the OTHER/RIGHT leg!  That time we had TPLO.  Much easier recuperation and better outcome.
Or vet told us at the time of the first injury....."it's not uncommon for these dogs to blow the other knee " :-(
About 2 yrs after that he was charged "out of nowhere" by an unleashed dog (my dog was leashed) and he tore the meniscus in the FIRST LEG/LEFT TRADITIONAL REPAIR.
Marlene


On Friday, June 12, 2020, 01:12:18 PM PDT, Elice Sturdivant elicesturdivant@yahoo.com [orthodogs] <orthodogs@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 

Hello,

Looking for some group input here, thanks in advance. Collin is a 7.5 84lb pit. At 6 months old, he was diagnosed with hip displasia and the vet recommended that we wait on any corrective surgery until he finished growing. THEN he tore the ACL in that knee and we decided it would not be prudent to wait. I can't remember the order that we had the surgeries, but ultimately we had a femoral head ostectomy and then the ACL repair (I think the lateral suture???)

Fast forward to December 2019- He tore the CCL in the same knee. He goes in for TPLO surgery in 2 weeks. I can't remember ever hearing about dog blowing out both tendons in the same leg. Does anyone have any experience with this? I would love to hear your input.

Thanks!
Elice Sturdivant and Collin

__._,_.___

Posted by: Marlene Gardner <platinumsun213@yahoo.com>
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (2)

.

__,_._,___

Orthodogs ACL and CCL? Collin

 

Hello,

Looking for some group input here, thanks in advance. Collin is a 7.5 84lb pit. At 6 months old, he was diagnosed with hip displasia and the vet recommended that we wait on any corrective surgery until he finished growing. THEN he tore the ACL in that knee and we decided it would not be prudent to wait. I can't remember the order that we had the surgeries, but ultimately we had a femoral head ostectomy and then the ACL repair (I think the lateral suture???)

Fast forward to December 2019- He tore the CCL in the same knee. He goes in for TPLO surgery in 2 weeks. I can't remember ever hearing about dog blowing out both tendons in the same leg. Does anyone have any experience with this? I would love to hear your input.

Thanks!
Elice Sturdivant and Collin

__._,_.___

Posted by: Elice Sturdivant <elicesturdivant@yahoo.com>
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (1)

.

__,_._,___

On Politics Poll Watch: Which Guy Do Voters Dislike Less?

As in 2016, many voters don’t like their presidential choices. But now it could help the Democrat.
Welcome to Poll Watch, our weekly look at polling data and survey research on the candidates, voters and issues that will shape the 2020 election.

It’s a truism of politics: When you’ve got an incumbent on the ballot, the race will be a referendum on her or his leadership — probably more than it’ll be about what the challenger is offering. So with President Trump’s approval rating stuck deep in the red, there’s little doubt that he is facing an uphill battle.

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But there’s a wrinkle to this situation: His likely Democratic opponent, Joseph R. Biden Jr., also has a favorability problem.

Polling suggests that this November’s election could become only the second presidential contest in the history of modern polling in which both candidates are seen negatively by most voters. The other was just four years ago, when pre-election surveys and exit polls found that both Mr. Trump and his Democratic rival, Hillary Clinton, were disliked by a majority of voters.

The fact that so many Americans in both the last election and this one have expressed an aversion to each of the major candidates speaks to the heavy polarization that now defines the national electorate — not to mention the wholesale disillusionment many voters feel with the political system.

As a result, there are large slices of voters whose support is basically predictable. “Elections are becoming more and more about pretty stark partisan divides between Democrats and Republicans,” Guy Cecil, a Democratic strategist who leads the Priorities USA Action super PAC, said in an interview.

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But there are specific contours to the negative views this time around that offer insights into the weaknesses that both Mr. Trump and Mr. Biden will need to address as their campaigns enter the summer months.

One key difference between this year and 2016 jumps out: In that election, people who saw both candidates unfavorably broke in favor of Mr. Trump, seeing him as the better of two bad options. This year, Mr. Biden holds an advantage — by a mile — among these ambivalent voters.

In a Monmouth University poll released last week, roughly one-fifth of voters did not express a positive view of either candidate (Mr. Trump’s net favorability rating was -19 in that poll; Mr. Biden’s was -7). Those voters broke hard for Mr. Biden, 59 percent to 18 percent.

In the days immediately leading up to the 2016 election, a Monmouth survey had found an even greater share of voters — 34 percent — saying they did not like either Mrs. Clinton or Mr. Trump. In that poll, Mrs. Clinton had a slimmer edge over Mr. Trump among those voters. After the election, exit polls and other postmortem polling found that they had in fact swung hard in Mr. Trump’s favor, with many changing their minds at the last minute.

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Thanks in large part to those voters, he squeaked by with an Electoral College victory, even though more people actually said they disliked him (60 percent) than said they disliked Mrs. Clinton (55 percent), according to exit polls.

The picture this year is different. Americans’ views of the president have hardened in place, and far fewer who dislike him are likely to vote for him again.

“If you’re a Trump voter, you don’t like him — you love him,” Frank Luntz, a veteran Republican pollster, said in an interview. “And nothing said by cable news or media is going to change that.”

He added, “But in the end, if you don’t like him, you’re just as passionate.”

Indeed, few voters express a mild view of Mr. Trump. In the Monmouth poll, 48 percent of the country had a “very unfavorable” view of him, while just 9 percent had a “somewhat unfavorable” opinion.

For Mr. Biden, that wasn’t the case.

“With Biden, you see a much more even split in his unfavorability rating,” Mr. Cecil said. “Among swing voters — to the extent that we have a shrinking number of swing voters — their views of Trump are much more intense than their views of Biden.”

And while Mr. Trump’s ratings have stayed relatively stable, Mr. Biden’s favorability numbers have been more fluid. Until last summer, most Americans held a positive view of the former vice president; it was only when his presidential run heated up that his favorability rating began to dip into negative territory, partly the result of attacks from his Democratic rivals.

In the early spring, as it became increasingly obvious that Mr. Biden would become the presumptive nominee, his average favorability ticked up, but it has since dropped again in most polls.

An average of five high-quality telephone polls taken last month found his favorability stuck just below even, with 45 percent holding a positive view of him on average, and 46 percent negative.

Most Democrats and Republicans continue to express a positive opinion of their party’s presumptive nominee. But while Mr. Trump enjoys his strongest support from Republicans and conservatives, Mr. Biden continues to struggle among certain key components of the Democratic base. One-third of liberals said they saw Mr. Biden unfavorably, according to the latest Monmouth poll, and only 19 percent of them said they held a “very favorable” view of him.

By contrast, Mr. Trump enjoyed some of his strongest support from conservative voters, most of whom saw him very favorably.

And among young people, typically a Democratic strong suit, Mr. Biden’s numbers remain anemic months after Senator Bernie Sanders — his main rival for the Democratic nomination, who had the loyal support of most young voters — left the race. Fifty-nine percent of Americans under 35 said they saw Mr. Biden negatively, per Monmouth. Only 8 percent expressed a very positive view of him.

Young people were particularly dissatisfied with their options: Those under 35 made up half of all the voters who saw neither candidate favorably.

All of this bodes poorly for Mr. Biden’s ability to excite his base — and indeed, 32 percent of Democrats in that poll said they were less enthusiastic than usual about voting in this year’s election. Among Republicans, only 12 percent said so.

But Mr. Trump’s inability to win over voters closer to the political middle could be a far graver problem than Mr. Biden’s mushy support on the left. Most political moderates tend to say they like Mr. Biden, and his net favorability rating among this group was +14 in the Monmouth poll.

Mr. Trump, on the other hand, is viewed quite negatively by most of those middle-path voters. Fully 57 percent of moderates expressed a “very unfavorable” view of him in the Monmouth survey; over all, his net favorability rating among them was -39.

“It’s not that they embrace or like Biden, so much as that they dislike Trump,” Mr. Luntz said of these voters in the middle. “They dislike Trump, and they’ve not made up their minds about Biden, because he was not a likely nominee as recently as 90 days ago.”

The latest Quinnipiac University poll contains evidence that Mr. Biden has room to grow. Unlike most, that survey offered respondents the option to say they hadn’t heard enough to make up their minds on whether they saw him favorably or unfavorably. Twelve percent of respondents said they needed more information about Mr. Biden before they decided. Just 3 percent said so about Mr. Trump.

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